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1

Firefighter
comment|71341|73076

We must clear up some ignorant statements here. I just went online to get some facts about languages spoken in Africa and I came away with the fact that they are only two countries in the world where English and French are official languages, these are Canada and Cameroon. I further checked some facts about his country and discovered that it was colonised by England and France, that's why they speak both French and English. Cameroon therefore is a bilingual country, so people from there can teach English anywhere in the world Including China. Talking about accent is even more of a slippery slope. Italians, Argentinians, French, some of whom came to China are teaching English with their truncated accents. They are not hiding, we see them out there everyday. The only reason they are teaching is because of their complexion. Most of them neither have valid certificates, nor the necessary skills to do the job. It's not as if those blacks who are denied jobs don't have MAs and PHDs, they do and their accents are far better than the Spaniads, Italians, in teaching students around here. Somebody from Quebec can teach French anywhere in the world, just as somebody from the English speaking provinces of Cameroon can teach English everywhere. Branding Cameroon a French corny and accusing the author of the article of dishonesty shows how far some can go to run down others. If you are ignorant of facts, you ought to read up. And quit second-guessing harping about what one's father would have done Or not in a public debate, you don't have all the truth. Chinese travel to Africa more than you and know who speaks English and who doesn't. I don't even know why people are still pouring spittle over this, most lacks were already sidelined, let those with white skin just do the job.

Jun 01, 2016 16:57 Report Abuse

2

POSITIONSEEKER01
comment|71403|50644

Youy have no clue of linguistics. The national origin or the citizenship of an individual doesn't determine his accent. Speakers holding the same passport have dramatically diverging levels of ability. Of course, a Spaniard or an Argentinan will often have a clearer "accent" (whatever that means in phonetics) than Scots, Cockneys, or people from the Appalachians. I met many Dutch that could perfectly pass for natives. Furthermore, according to recent studies, Hispanics are changing American English to the point that Hispanic English from either within or from outside the USA is becoming closer to American English.

Jun 02, 2016 20:33 Report Abuse

3

Guest14480640
comment|71467|1608960

"Cameroon English is an English dialect spoken predominantly in Cameroon, mostly learned as a second language.[1] It shares some similarities with English varieties in neighbouring West Africa, as Cameroon lies at the west of Central Africa.[2]" "Characteristic turns of phrase in the country or local coinages:[3] "detailly" = in detail "to see with me" = to agree with me; to see my point of view" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cameroonian_English

Jun 04, 2016 15:30 Report Abuse

4

Englteachted
comment|71337|263127

From what I gather (I only glanced over this) this guy confuses discrimination for standards and makes himself out to be the victim.. You're country was a French colony and doesn't even speak the same version of French so of course I'm not going to consider your country a native speaking country of English. The true victims of discrimination are black native speakers, asian native speakers and latino native speakers. Sadly overly sensitive people like this cloud real incidents of racism in China. French people can't legally get a visa to teach English in China as well as people from African countries, but you're too narrow mind and busy wrapping yourself in the blanket of victimhood. You are partially to blame for the discrimination directed at blacks from English speaking countries (and other Africans like you). When you lie to people in your African accent telling them you're from America you're teaching these simple minded buffoons that blacks can't speak English properly. You are training them to see all blacks as actually being African because 'they're probably just lying'. You clearly have issues that you need to address with yourself. How and why does it hurt to be reminded of your skin color? Annoyance, yes. I wanted to work at a university in Shenzhen but all required postgrad degrees, should I claim hurt feelings and blame them for not considering. Not doing work visas for Africans is a simple matter of legal requirements but requiring a teacher to have a MA or PHd is not. I have more reason to be offended but I'm an adult. Your views are one-sided and self-centered. A woman isn't supposed to have her own preferences? Some women prefer blacks, some whites, some anyone but Chinese. Do you stand up and protest for others? I'm gonna tell you what your father should have made clear (he tried but clearly did not want to waste time with you, that's why he hung up on you), man the hell up and deal. Stop expecting the world to change for you and go out there and find your opportunities. Let me end with this, what are your country's standards for teachers going there to teach English? Can a Chinese man walk in with their Chinese accent and get paid more than the locals to teach English? Exactly!

Jun 01, 2016 14:20 Report Abuse

5

ehill1515
comment|71360|247090

Ted's had a very hard life, Jason, and all he's gotten out of it is a simple teaching job that any white person could get. Don't ruin his free ride by acknowledging a troubling sociological issue which doesn't affect him.

Jun 02, 2016 02:41 Report Abuse

6

POSITIONSEEKER01
comment|71369|50644

Unlawful employment discrimination -not just discrimination- is defined as a preference for some individuals versus others whenever that preference is not based on the actual ability to perform at the occupation in question. Dark skin doesn't prevent anyone from being a good teacher. Coming from a social, educational, or national bacground may or may not. A native speaker is not, automatically, a better candidate than a non-native. The reason is to be found in the concept itself of linguistic competence and its practical implications. Also on the fact that even being a better sepaker doesn't entail being a better teacher of any given language. A competent second language speaker of English may often understand the process of language acquisition better.

Jun 02, 2016 07:46 Report Abuse

7

Englteachted
comment|71371|263127

You can't address any of my points because they're valid. So you resort to name calling. Where are you from? What laws/ guidelines does almost every country have for employing English teachers from abroad? That's not racism, it applies to countries outside of Africa too. Discrimination in China does exist but not with this situation. A black American being turned down for a job because he's black is discrimination. The writer seems to be using the firefighter handle, he compared his accent to French and Italians, that proves my point because they can't legally get visas to teach English in China also.

Jun 02, 2016 08:48 Report Abuse

8

dom87
comment|71328|102513

won't you have it easier with the new rules? If you have the qualifications I am sure you will land a job because they will need anyone who can get the z visa. If you can't meet even this basic requirements, then you are just not qualified. I don't say that the requirements make sense though... Proper requirements would obviously: For English language teachers -Studied English (non native) + Education / Linguistic + Education -nationality doesn't matter For subject teachers -Studied the field you want to teach in (for non natives + English study) -Studied education or some sort of Maybe education can be changed to some sort of delta celta tefl toeffl potatoe omega or whatever these tests are called. Accent might still always be a problem and even the highest qualified person can have a weird accent. Anyways, the stuff china does is weird

Jun 01, 2016 13:08 Report Abuse

9

shangguanruien
comment|71351|1605444

Actually, a degree in Teaching English as a Second Language should be required to teach ESL.

Jun 01, 2016 19:31 Report Abuse

10

Guest2223812
comment|71378|247090

Everyone: Google search "shangguanruien" and look at the posts that come up from BestGore.com and his VERY racist posts on Topix.com... This is the horse's ass who's been telling everyone their teaching credentials aren't up to snuff - a racist fucking pervert. It's great having a distinctive screenname, isn't is shang'? It's like having skid marks that won't come out of your underwear - your shit literally follows you around, wherever you go! :P

Jun 02, 2016 10:05 Report Abuse

11

shangguanruien
comment|71397|1605444

I remember you. You’re the guy who didn’t know the difference between a TESL degree and a TEFL certificate. Anyway, what is it about my comment that you find so offensive and necessary to vote down with each of your accounts? The OP was beating around the bush. I merely pointed out the FACT that a degree in TESL (or some related acronym) should be required to teach ESL. Is that not the requirement in your home country? You’ve probably been marketing yourself as a real ESL teacher in China and you’re afraid that recruiters will come across my posts and realize that you’re just another fraud. The jig is up.

Jun 02, 2016 18:56 Report Abuse

12

shangguanruien
comment|71400|1605444

I'm not sure how distinctive it is. My Google search pulled up several different users. This one's posts were particularly entertaining. <http://www.topix.com/member/profile/shangguanruien>

Jun 02, 2016 19:30 Report Abuse

13

nzteacher80
comment|71319|270608

China is a racially homogenous country which was incredibly insular for most of its history and remains largely like this to this day. Africans, except South Africans, can no longer work in China legally as an English teacher unless they have a degree grom a University from UK, USA, Australia, NZ, Ireland, Canada or SA. Western countries often disregard qualifications gained from universities in the developing world. China now does this too. I'm sorry about the authors experiences with discrimination in China but it is simply par for the course. You aren't going to change Chinese opinions.

Jun 01, 2016 12:15 Report Abuse

14

Guest762900
comment|71317|84766

e..

Jun 01, 2016 11:56 Report Abuse

15

ironman510
comment|71310|17779

Shouldnt this topic be in the Chinese news, in Chinese? We are not the ones who need to learn this.

Jun 01, 2016 11:00 Report Abuse

16

GaryWWrightJr
comment|71395|1592348

Looking at many of the comments, it appears that some of us *do* need to learn this.

Jun 02, 2016 18:28 Report Abuse

17

Guest922618
comment|71304|102513

it most likely has nothing to do with your color... Africa is not really famous for high education or quality education. Sorry but (no racism) I also don't want that my kids get taught by an African. I might be completely wrong, but as those Chinese I also don't know much about Africa and so I believe the stories (false or truth) that the education in Africa is very low level and thus how can someone teach in a different country which might have a higher education. (I don't talk about public low level schools here in china) You might say: "it's just English and I speak English very well and understand the grammar". But in fact your culture and your life experience always slide into your teaching our talking with the students. Then again; couldn't care less if the English teacher is black, pink or yellow, as long as he was educated from child's age in a developed country with high standard education. You see that is also the reason why the require a bachelor degree. A bachelor degree from UK is worth much more than from a bogus country like China. Sometime you have to see the whole picture and not only say everyone is racist. Yes it sucks to be privileged by born in some countries, but we all have to deal with it. While I am not from the top five, I am also not allowed to teach English (not that I want anyways). But I also know that I am not qualified to do that because I didn't study English nor it is my native language.

Jun 01, 2016 09:23 Report Abuse

18

Firefighter
comment|71311|73076

Yeah, it's like asking how someone who expect Xiaomi to do well in the US where the iPhone was made. No need to allow Xiaomi to prove its worth! We don't judge people according to where they come from, but according to their performance field. We have had a number of UN Secretary Generals from countries where their education cannot be compared to that of the UK or the US. China imports goods from many small countries whose culture and education are not comparable to those of China. Do you therefore trust them when they make these small products and doubt them when they train teachers? If you don't know much about Africa, wouldn't it be good to read up, than declare that it has very low education? As I know most African countries share the same culture with Europe and America and all subjects are taught in languages from these countries. People from Africa are therefore very much exposed to western culture. On what grounds would somebody claim the contrary? We should call things by their names. The simple reason why people are harping about being a native speaker or not is mostly tied to economics. From what I have read and heard, the first group of foreigners from different horizons who came to China before 2007 never knew any discrimination pertaining to their countries of origin. Things started changing around 2008 when the financial crisis hit home in the US. This is the time China saw the highest influx of "teachers" from the US and it did not take long for the discrimination to start. Statements like, " parents have the right to choose who teaches their children", " people from Africa should not apply", were rife. But you know what? When teachers from Africa and other minorities were sidelined, the truth came to the fore. Those men and women of dubious characters who hid under their complexion soon discovered that it was not going to be easy. The scandals they cause every day in schools do not prove that they were educated in places where education is better. Actually, although articles like these are good, the train left the station long ago. Africans who wanted to teach in China gave up and it is up to the Chinese to continue to cherry-picking whoever they want. But the hogwash about native speakers is meant to rob Paul and give to Peter. Anyone who tells you that those Africans who were educated in English, French and Portuguese cannot be better than those who used the same language for their education in the US or UK, is not being honest with themselves. Why have the native speakers been teaching in China for all these years and the general proficiency of students has only worsened? Who do we blame here? When you ask for the job you present yourself as native speaker, but when you do a bad job you blame the students, don't you?

Jun 01, 2016 11:37 Report Abuse

19

Guest2223812
comment|71381|247090

Nothing to do with color? Yes, because the Chinese certainly are magnanimous like that. In fact, they probably don't even see color - just like how they don't see other cars on the roadway.

Jun 02, 2016 10:32 Report Abuse

20

kessembi
comment|71414|1595843

And then walked in every dark skinned person in China who was mistaken for a continental African and hence rejected even an interview. Anyway...

Jun 03, 2016 07:52 Report Abuse

21

Guest14693038
comment|71303|1632559

Let me shed some light on this article. 1. China only issues a Z visas for English teachers who are citizens of the following countries: United States, New Zealand, UK, Australia, and Canada. These countries official language is English. 2. "You must be American or British" American and Britain is a melting pot of all races, not just white. 3. "Imagine you are in a foreign country sitting on a seat on the bus or on the train with the two other seats to your left and to your right deserted even though the bus is packed." How is this discrimination? People have a right to sit anywhere they want. 4. "Imagine you walking in the park just to relax, a little child sees you and says 'hello' happy to meet you and the mother grabs him and carries him away in her arms as if to say "how dare you go near that .... (I don't know what).”" Huh? The mother didn't actually say, "how dare you go near that..." She was just doing what every mother would do, which is being cautious around strangers (of any race). I wouldn't want my child approaching strangers (of any race), you never know what might happen. 5. "Imagine all the ads online carrying hurting phrases like: 'we don't do visas for African countries,' 'teachers from Africa— don't apply please' 'I want a boyfriend—no blacks'" China doesn't issue Z visas to people from countries whose official language is not English. People can date whomever they want, you can't force people to date people they don't want to date. This is a personal choice. Some people like blonds, some people like brunettes, that's okay. It's their personal preference. 6. "Imagine you walking on the street and every time you approach people someone is saying "Kan kan. Kan yi xia" or elbowing the other to see what kind of person is coming." Most white foreigners get this too, it's not just blacks. Chinese people are just curious. 7. Does this person have a bachelors degree? Does this person have a TEFL certificate or any kind of teaching certification? These are the requirements to get a Z visa to teach English in China.

Jun 01, 2016 08:19 Report Abuse

22

Chhris
comment|71336|273557

Also people from Ireland get Z visas and in some provinces South Africans too.

Jun 01, 2016 14:05 Report Abuse

23

ehill1515
comment|71358|247090

If I'm reading your ignorant diatribe correctly, then "racism isn't racist if it's a choice." I sincerely hope you're not a teacher, because your reasoning skills are good for shit.

Jun 02, 2016 02:28 Report Abuse

24

POSITIONSEEKER01
comment|71363|50644

China does issue Z visas to citizens of countries whose national language is not Engish; even to teach English. Can you guess how I happen to know this for a fact? America and Britain are a melting pot of various ethnicities to a limited degree only and in certain social settings only. The "white" wasp is the original culture of English speaking nations; not a multi-culti fantasy. Chinese and everyone else are very aware of that. Personal choices are legitimate and yet an act of discrimination; albeit not necessarily an unlawful or unethical one. Discriminate means to use judgement to opt, tell a difference, or give a case by case response. It comes from the Greek verb "crinei". For example, in English, a discriminative consumer is the one who knows what to buy as well as what not to buy.

Jun 02, 2016 07:05 Report Abuse

25

ehill1515
comment|71374|247090

I've never, once, known a Chinese school to discriminate on the basis of merit, whereas three times I've had part-time employers tell me they're not interested in my dark-skinned friends when they needed someone to do hours I couldn't cover. One of those friends was British, born and raised, but they didn't bother to ask about that; his picture was sufficient for them to pass...

Jun 02, 2016 10:00 Report Abuse